Summary The conversation revolves around the concept of 'eat shit, don't nibble' from the book 'The Hard Thing About Hard Things' by Ben Horowitz. We discuss the importance of facing challenges head-on and not avoiding or procrastinating difficult tasks. Travis and Dave emphasize the need to have open and honest conversations, addressing the whole issue instead of nibbling at it.
Takeaways
Face challenges head-on and don't procrastinate difficult tasks.
Have open and honest conversations, addressing the whole issue.
Build trust and transparency in relationships and work culture.
Clear communication is essential for growth and success.
Summary The conversation revolves around the concept of 'eat shit, don't nibble' from the book 'The Hard Thing About Hard Things' by Ben Horowitz. We discuss the importance of facing challenges head-on and not avoiding or procrastinating difficult tasks. Travis and Dave emphasize the need to have open and honest conversations, addressing the whole issue instead of nibbling at it.
Takeaways
Face challenges head-on and don't procrastinate difficult tasks.
Have open and honest conversations, addressing the whole issue.
Build trust and transparency in relationships and work culture.
Clear communication is essential for growth and success.
📖 To access Travis' complete book list, visit his storehere
Speaker 1:
Oh shit, this is Unleashing Leadership and I'm your host, travis Moss, and we're here with our special season five guest, dave Ni, as we get to lessons learned of the book the Hard Thing About Hard Things by Ben Horowitz. And I'm laughing because today's episode is about eat shit, don't nibble, which I already did an episode on this and I credited it to Warren Buffett. I used like a warrant, I didn't credit to him, I used the Warren Buffett, but I was really laughing because I'm really trying not to swear as much because on youtube when I swear, they don't like it, so they get. They get mad at art, like they won't put as you know, they won't monetize it as much and stuff. So I'm supposed to watch my language and, like our last episode, I, we were talking about silos and I didn't drop an f-bomb, the and we actually mentioned silos. So, uh, but this one, since it's you know, it's about eat shit, don't nibble, I feel like we're going to yeah, we're just going to screw this up.
Speaker 1:
We might as well keep it consistent through the whole thing, but anyway. So, uh, this episode is brought to you by Ditch the Suits podcast. Um, ditch the Suits is where we focus on helping you get more out of your money and your life. I'm one of the co-hosts on it with Steve Campbell, and you can get more information on that show by going to DitchTheSuitscom. It's got its own website. There's all kinds of stuff on there. Plus, you can go to our YouTube page, which is at NQR Media, and you can check out all the live clips and all the stuff that they shoot with that. There's some really good material there. So, but definitely, if you check it out, give us some reviews on there, give us a thumbs up or a comment or something. That just helps it all kind of get moving and that would help more people see it. So, anyhow, let's get back into this. Eat shit, don't nibble. So I have forgotten that. That was his quote. I think I had forgotten it was his quote um.
Speaker 2:
You used this on a on a newsletter.
Speaker 1:
The seed company also used it on a newsletter. Yeah, um. So I've probably talked enough about it, so I'll just let you go, just have at it okay, yeah, this is, this is one of your favorite ones, but I'll kick it off here.
Speaker 2:
Um, I think this one's funny. I'm gonna think I think of my, my boys, when I think of this. Um, I got three boys, five and under, so a lot goes on in the house and when they're doing something they shouldn't be doing, I kind of like let them do it under supervision, like I let it happen all the way. So they learned the lesson. Because, you know, whatever they they got, they got a little hurt or they, you know, they took it a little too far, because that's how they can. You know that's like the eating shit and not nibbling, because you kind of just do it the whole way.
Speaker 1:
You are an artist today. This is good. Keep going.
Speaker 2:
And then just like talk about it after, because if I keep stopping them before, like the actual consequence, right, like the nibbling if I'm, you know, don't do that, don't do that they're never actually going to learn, because sometime I'm not going to be there to tell them and they're going to do it, it's going to be worse. So I kind of look at it that way If you're going to make a mistake or you got to do the really hard thing, you just got to do it. If you keep putting it off or you try to chip it away or pass it off to somebody else, you're going to have that shit taste in your mouth for a long time instead of just kind of getting it done and washing it out yeah, I keep on forgetting exactly.
Speaker 1:
Every time I listen to the book I go oh yeah, that's right, that's what he's talking about. And then like, the further away from the book I get, the more I kind of make up a different meaning for it, because it fits so many meanings right, like it, just, it's a good. It's a good quote. Actually I'm hanging out in the yard and you know my neighbor's saying is if you're going to be a turd, go lay out in the yard. So of course I'm answering over the fence well, if you're going to use shit, don't nibble. So you know you can use this in many different places. But the big thing is is like it sometimes.
Speaker 1:
Sometimes things are just, I think in the context that we're talking about the book, sometimes things are just like man, they're tough, that's hard, right, and you can do a couple of things when things get hard. You can pretend they're not hard or you can. You can kind of complain a little bit, right. You just kind of like you ever notice somebody like that, that just they kind of bitch and moan a little bit and you don't really know what the problem is, but they're sulking and moping around and stuff and they're trying to get you to guess what's going on. And it's because they're depressed because something happened or they're scared about something, and it's like what the heck?
Speaker 2:
And that becomes normal for them, right? That's how they act.
Speaker 1:
Yeah, and they're kind of like nibbling at the problem, right. So you got the people who ignore the issues, like, like you know, like nobody can see them right, and then you got the people who kind of nibble at it, um, and then you got the people like you know steve affectionately calls me a sledgehammer sometimes like me, who are just like boom, here's what it is. And the whole point is just get through it already, right, like don't, don't perpetuate the suffering, just deal with it, get after it. You know, and if and if it's really bad, and it's one of those things that you know, you're, you're, we've talked about.
Speaker 1:
I think a couple episodes ago we talked about fear and bringing, bringing your, allowing your, your crew to come into your field. What we didn't mean by that is I'm terrified, you should be terrified. It is look, this is a big issue. We need to address this issue because this issue will dictate whether or not you get a raise next year, whether or not I got to let somebody go, or whether or not we're going to be in business, right. So there's a way to say like, look, here's a big, effing issue and we got to deal with this, um, and we're going to deal with the whole thing and the whole thing now, versus, well, you know, maybe we're going to see what happens, you know, and and you know, like, like the wishy-washy component of it?
Speaker 2:
yeah, do you think there is a scenario where, like nibbling is a better option? Is there anything like that that you could think of?
Speaker 1:
I think it's contextual. I think you've got to think about, I mean, with everything there there's situation awareness, like with the fear thing, right, I'm going to bring you into what I'm afraid of, but I'm not going to bring you in and terrify you, right? So I'm not going to let my, my emotion and my energy and stuff like that. I'm not gonna project that onto you, but I'm gonna like say, hey, look, here's, here's the concerns. And so I think the same thing with esha. Don't nibble like if, if, if, you just immediately go to blast mode every time. That's not really. But I think what we're talking about here is look, sometimes it's just rough man, and I knew a guy one time that talked about having unfinished conversations and his thing was you should never have an unfinished conversation. Say what you need to say, but say the whole damn thing. Don't come at me and say, look, you frustrate me. And I go how do I frustrate you? And you give me you know, you got a list of five things that frustrate you about me and you give me one of them. All right, fine, I'll fix that, I'll work on that. Well, it's not that one thing that you're frustrated with, it's all five things.
Speaker 1:
So then I come out and I think I'm good, I fixed. I'm like what's your problem now? And so you go. Well, it's just this thing here, right? What's going to help our friendship more If I come to you and I say why are you acting like this to me? And you go because of this, this and this, and you know what, if you could work on that, that and that, I'd be happy, versus I give you one. You're still not, so I'm still acting weird to you and I don't know why you're still acting weird, because I already addressed the thing that you were frustrated about, right? So it's like there's time you just got to get the stuff out in the open and just. And when you're beating around the bush or nibbling, you know you leave things unfinished and somebody's got to fill in the blanks. I think a little bit, or not be aware and look, just get it done with.
Speaker 2:
Yeah, we're really starting to talk about it. This kind of translates into earning trust then too, or preserving trust, because in the example you give, or if you're talking to an employee about the things they have to improve on, or whatever the case right, you're bringing them in on something that's important. If you're only giving them pieces of it at a time and kind of nibbling in the sense of this quote, then they're going to start questioning what the reality is, or what is the big picture here? Why am I only being fed little spoonfuls every time? And I would think that would hurt trust and transparency and all of that. So it kind of is a bigger picture than even just where we started that conversation.
Speaker 1:
Yeah, certainly at roads like culture or camaraderie. You know, if you've always got to look over your shoulder because you feel like you're being nitpicked, you know what I mean, because, like, let's say that, or just the situation's not properly explained, you know? I guess the other, as I'm thinking through this, the other thing too is I guess the other, as I'm thinking through this, the other thing too is you need people to be able to help you, as an organization, grow. And if the situation is dire and XYZ is probably going to have to happen if you want to grow and if you want to be strong and if you really want to get where you're going, your best chance is to just put it out there and say, hey, it's.
Speaker 1:
If you've ever watched eight mile with Eminem, right? What's eight mile do? Or what's he do at the very end, when he wins the wrap off, he basically goes out and he puts all his dirty laundry out there. Here's everything. And the reason why he does that is because there's nothing left for you to attack me on. You can't shame me anymore. Right? Here's the, here's the situation. Man, let's go. Yep, and I think that that's what we're getting to here. Is it sometimes you just when it's when it's bad. You just got to be like, hey look, it's bad and here's a through z, let's deal with it yeah, going all in you.